It makes a bigger hole. Much of the difference is Combat Medic's Advice: "Shoot the heaviest rifle roundshoot at Because size is king? Using the right bullet is where it counts. Black Talon .223 Rem in 5.56 NATO is OK. The FBI subsequently transitioned from revolvers to semi auto .40 caliber handguns with S&W .40 caliber bullets (a slightly shorter version of the 10mm round). at 2,690 feet per second, and slows to 840 feet per second at 500 yards. So its definitely capable. A 5 psi blast overpressure will rupture eardrums in about 1% of subjects, and a 45 psi overpressure will cause eardrum rupture in about 99% of all subjects. And other trauma surgeons are on record as saying that they cannot tell the difference between wounds caused by 9mm, .40 S&W, or .45 ACP. Doctors later determined that this round was not survivable. For a tommygun, I'd probably go with 1d8 base damage, +1 magical weapon bonus to represent penetration and damage, and the ability to make a cone area attack (save or take damage). ), provide a detailed description of the incident and review the critical importance of choosing the appropriate duty-carry handgun rounds for police officers. Ask the Mafia. One of the techniques used by several mob hit men was to use a .22 caliber pistol placed in the soft spot behind and slightly belo IMHO, everyone of us is different in all ways from head to toe and mostly including the brain and fitting a handgun is different for all. That and other factors. I shot 8 watermelons, 4 for each gun. ;p, I think someone is living in Television land, get real you might have shot one or chased a couple but routinely is in make believe land, quit lying just to talk. I know I prefer .45ACP. and manufacturers. When they enter the body, they spread out into a star-shaped pattern that enhances the damage caused by the wound channel. Thanks for reading and applying some little used common sense to the debate. But for those of us that like to aim and make good hits Ill take the 45 as a primary with a compact 9 as a backup. There are a number of factors involved, including physical, psychological and physiological, but human bodies are much more durable than is commonly believed. When they strike, the bullets rotate, and more of their surface hits the body. It has been reported by Heritage about how there are a number of personal protection gun uses that make the news in any given month, but are given a tiny fraction of the attention that mass shooters and other violent gun criminals receive. Government can spend less of my tax dollars (maybe. Their explanation (other than increasing ammo capacity): bullet technology has come a long way since 1986. The best stopping power is a complex mix of many different factors, including how fast the round is traveling and what it does when it enters the attackers body. Prefer a 9 mm. At least to the U.S. Marine Corps Forces Special Operations Command (MARSOC), there is no longer a question. You would think he would know a thing or two about firearms and ballistics with a title like that. Proper shot placement is the lamest argument based on logic. If these shootings have something in common, it is each and every one is different. Now call me a troll as I suspect you may be in love with your clunky Glock and .9mm round. I settled on a 9-round single-stack .40 S&W that has almost identical dimensions to the same pistol in 9mm. The slower 45acp round FMJ will pass through but leaving more energy expended plus a larger wound channel so the same to a lesser degree applies to the 45 acp FMJ; but, if you have 45acp JHP in the gun usually one hit whether it be in the shoulder, leg or chest area game over. Its hard for Civilians to understand the firepower of the Military & Police, and what they can choose to bring to bear on their target, but we are responsible for each bullet fired, as Civilians! With the 45 2 at most. Still, no one should select a caliber based on the assumption that it will expand sufficiently to incapacitate an assailant. To answer the question which is better 9mm or 45APC. There were 3 casings in the bathroom and a couple of more in the living room 10-12 ft away. Vector A pistol just sucks in that situation. Scratch expensive 45s. If you know firearms and know how to properly use them than the caliber shouldnt matter. Back then we all agreed the larger rounds had better stopping power. 45 acp damage human body Alvin York was a prodigy, a natural marksman of frankly terrifying and borderline-supernatural skill. Of Every Weapon In Battlegrounds Mobile India Where a bullet hits the human body is also a major factor on whether it inflicts a mortal wound. Even after suffering multiple 9mm gunshot wounds, victims are capable of fleeing considerable distances. When fragmentation occurs, the permanent cavity expands rapidly and dramatically. Anything else is a simple failure to prepare. SGT SmallwoodUSMC/LTC SmallwoodUSArmy retired. Lexipol. They are fine weapons and are certainly capable as a sidearm. As Sir Isaac Newton pointed out a few centuries ago, for every action theres an equal reaction in the opposite direction. I notice one parameter that seems to be ignored. I also have one that many people will call garbage. Never held a weapon till boot camp. The amount of energy a bullet radiates into a target is determined by a simple formula taught in high school: Its the product of one half the projectiles mass times the square of the velocity. The quibble is over. People have died from .22 LR in one shot. The 45 ACP is my choice of a Heavy Hitter. My $.02. I meanwtf? F = MA is absolutely true as it applies to ballistics. We were already running +P for our 9 9mms. As long as YOU are comfortable with the choice, then Im happy for you! 45 ACP Of handgun owners alone, 63 percent owned these for the purpose of protecting themselves against other people, with another 20 percent owning them for protection against animals. This, as with any other type of penetration test, is plagued with inaccuracies. Another deputy acquired a .45 and was having trouble being able to qualify with it. This post has been updated to include information released by the FBI regarding the weapon used in the shooting. I carry a number of different calibers depending on what Im wearing that day and where I intend to go; but I no longer even own a 9mm. 1SGT. The comments concerning shot placement are correct. 12 shots fired. We need to dial back our expectations of what a pistol cartridge can and cant do as an instrument of CQB. There is also the very real factor of life-or-death, fight-or-flight stress. It is also of considerable general interest if for no other reason than to show how often the movie makers and novel writers make appalling blunders. In the words of Dr. Peter Rhee, a leading trauma surgeon and a retired Navy captain with 24-years of service, talking about all handgun wounds including .45 ACP and 9mm, he said, A Handgun wound is simply a stabbing with a bullet. Has the Marine Corp's choice to transition from 45 ACP to 9mm duty pistols settled the debate on which caliber is better? For the sake of interest, some indicators of the penetrative powers of various types of ammunition follow: Virtually all calibres (excepting air weapons) will penetrate the tread or side wall of a motor vehicle tyre. WebThe 45 will but them down and bleed them out real quick with a gut shot, the 9mm will have them flopping around and may not stop them from firing back, also from the pools of blood near the bodies the 45 does more damage. Give me a 45 any day! Practice thats all it takes. WebCapitola Mansion Apartments, Off Grid Cabin Canada, Seth Smith Actor Age, Parma High School Football Schedule, Roxiticus Country Club Membership Fees, Jquery Time Slot Booking Calendar, 45 Acp Damage Human Body, Maricopa News Shooting, Tws I12 Keeps Powering Off, Long Term Rentals Camber Sands, You know, Indians killed each other, white settlers, and hunted with a bow &. quick defense trigger and has an extended 17rnd clip. Just as many others I was forced throughout a 25 yr L.E. Shot placement vs. Just happened to recall the powerful 10 auto cartridge. It may take 2 rounds to take someone down, but the shooter will have a lot easier follow up shots with the smaller 9mm. I also do not understand why the M&P was disqualified, but it could be that other manufacturers guns have already been eliminated as well. Because its difficult to pack enough explosive powder into a cartridge thats supposed to fit within the shooters pistol grip, handgun designers typically try to increase firepower by sticking a bigger piece of metal on the end of a round. I seem to recall reading in Rangemaster newsletter a month or two ago an FBI paper making the FMJ case. The pistol with speed loaders will get me to the riffels then game over if not over yet. Indeed, if 9mm used the same grain of bullet, the ft/lb and velocities are near-identical. However, there are two factors virtually everyone agrees on: 1. Note that buying a handgun for personal protection is not an abstract desire. Really lets cut to the chase. And it is acceptable to me that they made at least some of their determination based on the need to accommodate smaller hands. Now lets talk about wound cavities caused by different caliber handgun rounds. Youll immediately learn the, Why didnt I squeeze the trigger when I had the shot? At 880 fps a 230 grains projectile has 395 foot pounds of muzzle energy. As for accuracy, I hear a lot of my friends talking about the accuracy of their 45s over a distance compared to my 9 mm, but no one to date has outshot me on the range, and almost all of my friends have switched to a 9 millimeter in the past few years. It has a velocity of 1200-1600 ft/s and energy of 140-160 Joules. Why arent both so much better than .223? Through and through shots were the issue and the 9 just bounced of bones and exited. The louder the pop the more credence is added to his choice to continue in his efforts his engagement with you. The gun was designed prior to WW1 and its main usage was close combat in regards to trench warfare. Hydrostatic shock Many years ago in auto racing, there was a saying regarding power. Just some REAL world observation not keyboard commando stuff. How about a test sample of exactly the same bullet weight in a high impact L.E. There is little or no noticeable difference in wound tracks between 9mm Luger, .40 S&W and .45 Auto premium line rounds. What do you Think of the S&W Shield? Pretty broad pattern where adrenaline can also make hands shake. A .223 is just 55 grains. Everyone should be mocking the .223 as a pea shooter. Tissue disruption caused by a handgun bullet is limited to two mechanisms: There are two places that we know will incapacitate a man every time they are hit: the brain and the upper spinal column. Different bullets and guns have different patterns. Ive been training for 50+ years and continue to do so. Episode 424 is the perfect companion to this post because we discuss caliber and it's relation to hit factor! Open the tools menu in your browser. I still did like the 39-2 for CC. FN DUH! I thought I would never own a 9 mm. And let us not forget the adrenaline factor. And the quicker the better when someones fanning a gun at you. Do any one you know carry just ball rounds in their handguns? I owned a 9mm years ago and liked the gun, though the grip was too large for me due to the double stack magazine. Note how velocity is squared, and mass is halved. Elton Makin was a US marine in World War One. In September 1918 American troops had overrun the German front line, and he was sent back carrying a They should have several different handguns depending on the shoot I myself at 6 to 200 pounds and have a large chance by far the best pistol Ive ever shot is the 1911. The only way to ensure immediate incapacitation is to shoot the adversary in the brain or upper spinal cord (i.e., central nervous system). Such as my Kimber and Walther and can never forget the CZ shadow 2. I totally agree about shot placement. If youre being attacked or in the process of deterring an oncoming attack, fear can have an affect. Ask deerhunters. It has less recoil, is less expensive and its penetration apparently compares favorably with the larger-sized rounds. The amount of energy a bullet radiates into a target is determined by a simple formula taught in high school: Its the product of one half the projectiles mass times the square of the velocity. Yes, Alvin York killed seven Germans with seven rounds of .45 ACP ball, starting from almost 100m out, in front of superior officers who went out afterwards and kicked the dead Huns in the head before they made their reports. 15 -25 yards lol I can hit you in between the eyes with my co2 bb pistol. The human body experiences four main types of acid-based disorders: metabolic acidosis, metabolic alkalosis, respiratory acidosis, and respiratory alkalosis. The comparisons that I have seen conducted under those conditions seem to be pretty equal. I have also recorded a few single-shot kills from a .45ACP, one from as far the article mentions that where a bullet hits the human body is also a major factor on whether it inflicts a mortal wound. Okay, I have to give them props on this part of the statement because this is 100% correct. 25 ft same situation, I was surprised at 50 ft when my 45 actually tore the watermelon to shreds even more so than 15 and 25ft, the 9mm remained the same, 100 ft I actually missed 3 times with my Walther q4 9mm before I hit. Example; a bb to the eyeball is very effective. Also, the 9mm cartridges are less expensive. I like it and am very comfortable pulling the trigger in as high stress of a situation as training allows. But only weighed 140 lbs then. The .45, for instance, is slightly slower than the 9mm, but features a more massive projectile, with 250 grains of mass compared to the 9mms typical 115 grains. Gimme a break! 7.62 leads the damage potential, followed by 5.56, followed by 45 and finally 9 mm. However, from close enough range you could manage. Head on over to the Concealed Carry Podcast for great audio content. Web45 ACP Ammo | 45 ACP Ammo for Sale | Ammunition Depot 3/2/2023 ON SALE Ammunition Bulk Ammo Bulk 223 Ammo Bulk 9mm Ammo Bulk 45 ACP Ammo Bulk 380 Ammo Bulk 308 Ammo Bulk 7.62x39 Ammo Bulk 22 LR Ammo Bulk Pistol Ammo Bulk Rifle Ammo Bulk Shotgun Ammo Handgun Ammo 9mm Ammo 380 Ammo 45 ACP Ammo 38 Special Temporary cavity is often grossly overrated as a wounding factor, but has historically been one of the primary methods for measuring effectiveness. .45 ACP Damage Body Shots Head Shots Sounds Firing (9mm) Firing (.45 ACP) Reloading Swapping To Rarity The Vector is a rare SMG that spawns mainly in Hatchet Cases in the Hydra Bunker and rarely in the Storm Bunker (10% chance). After reading comments from many veterans here, and from what ive seen on the streets, in a true life or death situation give me the largest slug possible. In fact, thats what civil liberty defense ammo is all about. How about a discussion of American made vs foreign made weapons for our military? And It will get the job done quite handily. According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation, Hodgkinson was armed with a rifle that shot 7.62 caliber bullets. The same companies make the 45acp and other calibers! There were no exit wounds. Microplastics are in our bodies. How much do they harm us? S&W was required to announce it due to SEC requirements as they are one of the only publicly-owner companies. I would make the same recommendation to all American law enforcement agencies who are considering a switch to 9mm handguns. Its a freaking tarantula. My understanding in past test 9mms dont do well in front car windshield stops. He came up in this world initially through his 8-year experience with a state-level law enforcement agency in Colorado. When a lot of agencies began switching to 9mm from .45 ACP and other heavier calibers, something became very apparent: the FMJ 9mm at high velocity tended For the better part of a decade, working on the streets in 2 of the 4 most dangerous neighborhoods in these United States, (per semi-annual FBI Violent Crime statistics) shot distance and circumstance can NOT be accurately anticipated. How does air resistance have ANYTHING to do with the terminal ballistics as they relate to penetration? damage One or two out of every twenty or more perfect placement leaves me desirous of a heavy hitter. The paramedics said he probably would not live. Richard, I guess I have little feminine hands as I prefer to carry my 9mm for self-defense and on duty. Most of the ballistic testing I have seen comparing the penetration of various bullets and calibers would suggest that generally, a .45ACP and 9mm are both quite comparable as far as penetration is concerned. The 45 is the preferred for close combat, Common sense will tell you that if you are being overrun! In the end public opinion and perception has a great deal to do with defense decisions. Weve known this for, what, eighty years now? I have both, like them all, and carry them because rifles are hard to conceal! In this article, we will present what we believe to be the most credible information regarding wound ballistics from studies conducted by the FBIs Firearms Training Academy in legendary Quantico, Virginia. F=MA always applies to the known laws of physics. It scares the hell out of me to think I might have had to use a 9 mm. cause if they did there would not be so many innocent victims being injured and killed all because they couldnt hit the side of a barn with a soft ball from 5 ft. Only high-velocity rounds (those with an impact velocity of 2,000 feet per second or more) with soft or hollow points reliably offer fragmentation. I imagine humans are the same. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); 2023 Concealed Carry Inc. All Rights Reserved. Its all about follow up shots. A century? I do believe that whether its a 9 mm or 45 caliber youve got to be accurate with the placement of that round otherwise youre just wasting shots. Im 73 yoa. Sudden, immediate and even instant death. It doesnt get more damaging that that. Remember, people dont have health bars. One single shot from nea When the .223 exits the barrel of a gun, it flies at more than 3,200 feet per second, and is still going 1,660 feet per second after traveling 500 yards. The science says otherwise. I have read how the 124gr 9mm ammo used by NATO does not do its intended job. Copyright 2023 I spent FAR more money letting her out every pistol they had for rent than I did purchasing her final choice. I also reload/handload have shot competitively and have hunted all my life. I like both, so it is a matter of how balanced and comfortable is it when in use ? I also am a NRA Certified Instructor and gunsmith in Colorado. I have several. The Simple Physics That Makes Some Bullets Deadlier Than Very accurate and deadly, The bullet travels at 1450 FPS. Leave it to a bunch of idiot Marines to bring a pistol to a rifle fight. However, for the civilian this is generally an impractical plan for a variety of reasons. Pain is generally physiologically irrelevant, but where present often just makes motivated targets angry and thus, more motivated. Plenty of gang shootings. Much more likely is that you will be suddenly and unexpectedly attacked by a rapidly and unpredictably moving target with limited opportunities for counter attack. Whether it hits the shoulder, the leg, arm, hip, whatever. He was a deputy sheriff. Tissue inside the human body is remarkably elastic, even vital organs such as the lungs, bowels or circulatory system. WebA 9mm -40 - 357sig -45 ACP all do about 11-13" penetration into the human body no temporary wound cavity, and the diamiter differnce is from 9mm(.355(.357 caliber)) to 11.5mm(.45 caliber). Kimber 1911 Rapide Dawn .45 ACP Pistol $ 1649 99 1649 dollars 99 cents. The will to live and fight varies from person-to-person. In the technical language of ballistics engineers, the standard unit of measurement for a bullets mass is grains of metal, and depending on the manufacturer, a .7.62. can weigh in at 125 grains. 45 ACP The money has to come from somewhere. Its too small. Its certain to elicit a wide variety of opinions and almost as likely to stir up an argument. 15 round mag of 9mm FMJ unless you hit the heart better plan on using 3 to 5 rounds to stop the person. Yes, yeas I have. I sort of like the Canik TP9v2, with Browning BXP xpoint 147 gr load. The tests resulted in the selection in 1989 of the 10mm bullet as the most effective and accurate round for FBI agents to carry. by Kyle Mizokami Key Point: These are the bullets that will do the The body's liver, pancreas and kidneys also can make about 1 gram of creatine per day. If you dont have an excellent chance against a large carnivore with it. In winter I concealed carry a 1911. This is just one of them: https://www.policeone.com/police-heroes/articles/6199620-Why-one-cop-carries-145-rounds-of-ammo-on-the-job/. The past 45 years never needed more than one shot. When the cavalry at the time switched to the .45 round, the round was effective in doing enough damage to put them down more effectively. A 9mm round fired at close range to the skull with the correct ammunition will be fatal nearly all the time. Guy KEPT COMING and managed to shoot back twice. Not aim shoot. Also another fact is that my Kimber Colt 45 actually has less recoil than my 9mm with an aluminum frame when my 9mm has a full steel from. Seems to me that American businesses take it in the chin enough already without this insult. The 5 Most Controversial Handgun Rounds The one thing Ive learned and seen over a lot of shooting is that a 9mm with FMJ bullets is mostly useless. The fact is, 9mm is fast and cheap, .45acp is big and just as effective if not more, given the wound channel is gonna be much larger than that of a 9mm. In this dangerous time period, an officers adversary can continue his deadly actions against an officer. 3 more replies -8w7- 13 hr. Circulatory collapse results from massive bleeding caused by bullet wounds primarily to the heart, other major organs or major blood vessels of the torso. He carries a nine personally currently because of the round capacity but in combat 45. Im sure, given the choice, MARSOC troops would take a 15 round FNX45 over a Glock 15. So modern ammo IS NOT the reason to switch back to the 9mm. During each tour I was personally involved multiple combat engagements. Copyright 2023 At that long distance, the .223 will slam into its target with almost twice the speed of the .22. In my book Lethal Force and the Objectively Reasonable Officer, I point out that after the FBI shootout in Miami, the FBI Firearms Training Unit, under the leadership of Unit Chief John Hall, tested 9mm, 10mm and .45 caliber rounds. But associates I worked with and against on jobs they all use one main gun to kill with the 9 mm with silencer. Smith & Wesson Model 26 | Project: Aftermath Wiki | Fandom The germans used 9mm forever and they know their guns and war making. But honestly, if you cannnot conceal a 1911 you cant conceal a G19.. Thats a bs statement, I know this because I carry concealed and my 1911 conceals just as well as a single stack 9mm compact. and departments. If you can fire without remorse. first handgun i ever fired was glock27 .40SW she was snappy at first but 16 years later and after shooting lots of .45 and 9, i am back to .40SW for HD purposes. I think everyone should think back to why the 1911 was made. The better the bullet and the shot placement of an officer, the more likely the officer will go home after a shooting. But the modern bullets are getting better all the time! 2 from 15 ft, 2 from 25 ft, jumping to 2 from 50 ft. And 2 from 100ft. 10..again 10 rounds landed on target. Platt was killed at the end of the gunfight, but not before unleashing deadly mayhem. Gramins was using a 13+1 capacity Glock 21 in .45 ACP. A tenured officer responded to a violent male mental on a *TD bus. R45 Ammo Type: .45 ACP. Media in category "Human body" The following 64 files are in this category, out of 64 total. I have several 1911 pistols. I have shot many different calibers. Everyone talking about knock down power verses speed seems like. You're Dead: 5 Deadliest Bullets In The World They're just as important as the gun that fires them. In the last 30 years, the FBI has moved from .38/.357 caliber revolvers to 9mm semi-automatics. That use the same ammo is the way for me. In combat the one thing that does count is having more capacity, whether you miss or have more threats to neutralize, more capacity is a good thing no matter how you look at it. Repeat over and over, and keep doing so even after proficiency is achieved. To the extent the wound components cause or increase the effects of these two mechanisms, the likelihood of incapacitation increases. Most people ask to be shot with the 9mm instead of the .45acp. This remained the norm in the FBI until May 2014. The projectile, a 7.62 x 39 bullet, hit the House majority whip with between 370 and 1,550 foot-pounds of force. Anyway great comments to all. Thats the secret. I Have hair and an angular face.
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Combat Medic's Advice: "Shoot the heaviest rifle roundshoot at Because size is king? Using the right bullet is where it counts.
Black Talon .223 Rem in 5.56 NATO is OK. The FBI subsequently transitioned from revolvers to semi auto .40 caliber handguns with S&W .40 caliber bullets (a slightly shorter version of the 10mm round). at 2,690 feet per second, and slows to 840 feet per second at 500 yards. So its definitely capable. A 5 psi blast overpressure will rupture eardrums in about 1% of subjects, and a 45 psi overpressure will cause eardrum rupture in about 99% of all subjects. And other trauma surgeons are on record as saying that they cannot tell the difference between wounds caused by 9mm, .40 S&W, or .45 ACP. Doctors later determined that this round was not survivable. For a tommygun, I'd probably go with 1d8 base damage, +1 magical weapon bonus to represent penetration and damage, and the ability to make a cone area attack (save or take damage). ), provide a detailed description of the incident and review the critical importance of choosing the appropriate duty-carry handgun rounds for police officers. Ask the Mafia. One of the techniques used by several mob hit men was to use a .22 caliber pistol placed in the soft spot behind and slightly belo IMHO, everyone of us is different in all ways from head to toe and mostly including the brain and fitting a handgun is different for all. That and other factors. I shot 8 watermelons, 4 for each gun. ;p, I think someone is living in Television land, get real you might have shot one or chased a couple but routinely is in make believe land, quit lying just to talk. I know I prefer .45ACP. and manufacturers. When they enter the body, they spread out into a star-shaped pattern that enhances the damage caused by the wound channel. Thanks for reading and applying some little used common sense to the debate. But for those of us that like to aim and make good hits Ill take the 45 as a primary with a compact 9 as a backup. There are a number of factors involved, including physical, psychological and physiological, but human bodies are much more durable than is commonly believed. When they strike, the bullets rotate, and more of their surface hits the body. It has been reported by Heritage about how there are a number of personal protection gun uses that make the news in any given month, but are given a tiny fraction of the attention that mass shooters and other violent gun criminals receive. Government can spend less of my tax dollars (maybe. Their explanation (other than increasing ammo capacity): bullet technology has come a long way since 1986. The best stopping power is a complex mix of many different factors, including how fast the round is traveling and what it does when it enters the attackers body. Prefer a 9 mm. At least to the U.S. Marine Corps Forces Special Operations Command (MARSOC), there is no longer a question. You would think he would know a thing or two about firearms and ballistics with a title like that. Proper shot placement is the lamest argument based on logic. If these shootings have something in common, it is each and every one is different. Now call me a troll as I suspect you may be in love with your clunky Glock and .9mm round. I settled on a 9-round single-stack .40 S&W that has almost identical dimensions to the same pistol in 9mm. The slower 45acp round FMJ will pass through but leaving more energy expended plus a larger wound channel so the same to a lesser degree applies to the 45 acp FMJ; but, if you have 45acp JHP in the gun usually one hit whether it be in the shoulder, leg or chest area game over. Its hard for Civilians to understand the firepower of the Military & Police, and what they can choose to bring to bear on their target, but we are responsible for each bullet fired, as Civilians! With the 45 2 at most. Still, no one should select a caliber based on the assumption that it will expand sufficiently to incapacitate an assailant. To answer the question which is better 9mm or 45APC. There were 3 casings in the bathroom and a couple of more in the living room 10-12 ft away.
Vector A pistol just sucks in that situation. Scratch expensive 45s. If you know firearms and know how to properly use them than the caliber shouldnt matter. Back then we all agreed the larger rounds had better stopping power.
45 acp damage human body Alvin York was a prodigy, a natural marksman of frankly terrifying and borderline-supernatural skill.
Of Every Weapon In Battlegrounds Mobile India Where a bullet hits the human body is also a major factor on whether it inflicts a mortal wound. Even after suffering multiple 9mm gunshot wounds, victims are capable of fleeing considerable distances. When fragmentation occurs, the permanent cavity expands rapidly and dramatically. Anything else is a simple failure to prepare. SGT SmallwoodUSMC/LTC SmallwoodUSArmy retired. Lexipol. They are fine weapons and are certainly capable as a sidearm. As Sir Isaac Newton pointed out a few centuries ago, for every action theres an equal reaction in the opposite direction. I notice one parameter that seems to be ignored. I also have one that many people will call garbage. Never held a weapon till boot camp. The amount of energy a bullet radiates into a target is determined by a simple formula taught in high school: Its the product of one half the projectiles mass times the square of the velocity. The quibble is over. People have died from .22 LR in one shot. The 45 ACP is my choice of a Heavy Hitter. My $.02. I meanwtf? F = MA is absolutely true as it applies to ballistics. We were already running +P for our 9 9mms. As long as YOU are comfortable with the choice, then Im happy for you!
45 ACP Of handgun owners alone, 63 percent owned these for the purpose of protecting themselves against other people, with another 20 percent owning them for protection against animals. This, as with any other type of penetration test, is plagued with inaccuracies. Another deputy acquired a .45 and was having trouble being able to qualify with it. This post has been updated to include information released by the FBI regarding the weapon used in the shooting. I carry a number of different calibers depending on what Im wearing that day and where I intend to go; but I no longer even own a 9mm. 1SGT. The comments concerning shot placement are correct. 12 shots fired. We need to dial back our expectations of what a pistol cartridge can and cant do as an instrument of CQB. There is also the very real factor of life-or-death, fight-or-flight stress. It is also of considerable general interest if for no other reason than to show how often the movie makers and novel writers make appalling blunders. In the words of Dr. Peter Rhee, a leading trauma surgeon and a retired Navy captain with 24-years of service, talking about all handgun wounds including .45 ACP and 9mm, he said, A Handgun wound is simply a stabbing with a bullet. Has the Marine Corp's choice to transition from 45 ACP to 9mm duty pistols settled the debate on which caliber is better? For the sake of interest, some indicators of the penetrative powers of various types of ammunition follow: Virtually all calibres (excepting air weapons) will penetrate the tread or side wall of a motor vehicle tyre. WebThe 45 will but them down and bleed them out real quick with a gut shot, the 9mm will have them flopping around and may not stop them from firing back, also from the pools of blood near the bodies the 45 does more damage. Give me a 45 any day! Practice thats all it takes. WebCapitola Mansion Apartments, Off Grid Cabin Canada, Seth Smith Actor Age, Parma High School Football Schedule, Roxiticus Country Club Membership Fees, Jquery Time Slot Booking Calendar, 45 Acp Damage Human Body, Maricopa News Shooting, Tws I12 Keeps Powering Off, Long Term Rentals Camber Sands, You know, Indians killed each other, white settlers, and hunted with a bow &. quick defense trigger and has an extended 17rnd clip. Just as many others I was forced throughout a 25 yr L.E. Shot placement vs. Just happened to recall the powerful 10 auto cartridge. It may take 2 rounds to take someone down, but the shooter will have a lot easier follow up shots with the smaller 9mm. I also do not understand why the M&P was disqualified, but it could be that other manufacturers guns have already been eliminated as well. Because its difficult to pack enough explosive powder into a cartridge thats supposed to fit within the shooters pistol grip, handgun designers typically try to increase firepower by sticking a bigger piece of metal on the end of a round. I seem to recall reading in Rangemaster newsletter a month or two ago an FBI paper making the FMJ case. The pistol with speed loaders will get me to the riffels then game over if not over yet. Indeed, if 9mm used the same grain of bullet, the ft/lb and velocities are near-identical. However, there are two factors virtually everyone agrees on: 1. Note that buying a handgun for personal protection is not an abstract desire. Really lets cut to the chase. And it is acceptable to me that they made at least some of their determination based on the need to accommodate smaller hands. Now lets talk about wound cavities caused by different caliber handgun rounds. Youll immediately learn the, Why didnt I squeeze the trigger when I had the shot? At 880 fps a 230 grains projectile has 395 foot pounds of muzzle energy. As for accuracy, I hear a lot of my friends talking about the accuracy of their 45s over a distance compared to my 9 mm, but no one to date has outshot me on the range, and almost all of my friends have switched to a 9 millimeter in the past few years. It has a velocity of 1200-1600 ft/s and energy of 140-160 Joules. Why arent both so much better than .223? Through and through shots were the issue and the 9 just bounced of bones and exited. The louder the pop the more credence is added to his choice to continue in his efforts his engagement with you. The gun was designed prior to WW1 and its main usage was close combat in regards to trench warfare.
Hydrostatic shock Many years ago in auto racing, there was a saying regarding power. Just some REAL world observation not keyboard commando stuff. How about a test sample of exactly the same bullet weight in a high impact L.E. There is little or no noticeable difference in wound tracks between 9mm Luger, .40 S&W and .45 Auto premium line rounds. What do you Think of the S&W Shield? Pretty broad pattern where adrenaline can also make hands shake. A .223 is just 55 grains. Everyone should be mocking the .223 as a pea shooter. Tissue disruption caused by a handgun bullet is limited to two mechanisms: There are two places that we know will incapacitate a man every time they are hit: the brain and the upper spinal column. Different bullets and guns have different patterns. Ive been training for 50+ years and continue to do so. Episode 424 is the perfect companion to this post because we discuss caliber and it's relation to hit factor! Open the tools menu in your browser. I still did like the 39-2 for CC. FN DUH! I thought I would never own a 9 mm. And let us not forget the adrenaline factor. And the quicker the better when someones fanning a gun at you. Do any one you know carry just ball rounds in their handguns? I owned a 9mm years ago and liked the gun, though the grip was too large for me due to the double stack magazine. Note how velocity is squared, and mass is halved. Elton Makin was a US marine in World War One. In September 1918 American troops had overrun the German front line, and he was sent back carrying a They should have several different handguns depending on the shoot I myself at 6 to 200 pounds and have a large chance by far the best pistol Ive ever shot is the 1911. The only way to ensure immediate incapacitation is to shoot the adversary in the brain or upper spinal cord (i.e., central nervous system). Such as my Kimber and Walther and can never forget the CZ shadow 2. I totally agree about shot placement. If youre being attacked or in the process of deterring an oncoming attack, fear can have an affect. Ask deerhunters. It has less recoil, is less expensive and its penetration apparently compares favorably with the larger-sized rounds. The amount of energy a bullet radiates into a target is determined by a simple formula taught in high school: Its the product of one half the projectiles mass times the square of the velocity. Yes, Alvin York killed seven Germans with seven rounds of .45 ACP ball, starting from almost 100m out, in front of superior officers who went out afterwards and kicked the dead Huns in the head before they made their reports. 15 -25 yards lol I can hit you in between the eyes with my co2 bb pistol. The human body experiences four main types of acid-based disorders: metabolic acidosis, metabolic alkalosis, respiratory acidosis, and respiratory alkalosis. The comparisons that I have seen conducted under those conditions seem to be pretty equal. I have also recorded a few single-shot kills from a .45ACP, one from as far the article mentions that where a bullet hits the human body is also a major factor on whether it inflicts a mortal wound. Okay, I have to give them props on this part of the statement because this is 100% correct. 25 ft same situation, I was surprised at 50 ft when my 45 actually tore the watermelon to shreds even more so than 15 and 25ft, the 9mm remained the same, 100 ft I actually missed 3 times with my Walther q4 9mm before I hit. Example; a bb to the eyeball is very effective. Also, the 9mm cartridges are less expensive. I like it and am very comfortable pulling the trigger in as high stress of a situation as training allows. But only weighed 140 lbs then. The .45, for instance, is slightly slower than the 9mm, but features a more massive projectile, with 250 grains of mass compared to the 9mms typical 115 grains. Gimme a break!
7.62 leads the damage potential, followed by 5.56, followed by 45 and finally 9 mm. However, from close enough range you could manage. Head on over to the Concealed Carry Podcast for great audio content. Web45 ACP Ammo | 45 ACP Ammo for Sale | Ammunition Depot 3/2/2023 ON SALE Ammunition Bulk Ammo Bulk 223 Ammo Bulk 9mm Ammo Bulk 45 ACP Ammo Bulk 380 Ammo Bulk 308 Ammo Bulk 7.62x39 Ammo Bulk 22 LR Ammo Bulk Pistol Ammo Bulk Rifle Ammo Bulk Shotgun Ammo Handgun Ammo 9mm Ammo 380 Ammo 45 ACP Ammo 38 Special Temporary cavity is often grossly overrated as a wounding factor, but has historically been one of the primary methods for measuring effectiveness. .45 ACP Damage Body Shots Head Shots Sounds Firing (9mm) Firing (.45 ACP) Reloading Swapping To Rarity The Vector is a rare SMG that spawns mainly in Hatchet Cases in the Hydra Bunker and rarely in the Storm Bunker (10% chance). After reading comments from many veterans here, and from what ive seen on the streets, in a true life or death situation give me the largest slug possible. In fact, thats what civil liberty defense ammo is all about. How about a discussion of American made vs foreign made weapons for our military? And It will get the job done quite handily. According to the Federal Bureau of Investigation, Hodgkinson was armed with a rifle that shot 7.62 caliber bullets. The same companies make the 45acp and other calibers! There were no exit wounds.
Microplastics are in our bodies. How much do they harm us? S&W was required to announce it due to SEC requirements as they are one of the only publicly-owner companies. I would make the same recommendation to all American law enforcement agencies who are considering a switch to 9mm handguns. Its a freaking tarantula. My understanding in past test 9mms dont do well in front car windshield stops. He came up in this world initially through his 8-year experience with a state-level law enforcement agency in Colorado. When a lot of agencies began switching to 9mm from .45 ACP and other heavier calibers, something became very apparent: the FMJ 9mm at high velocity tended For the better part of a decade, working on the streets in 2 of the 4 most dangerous neighborhoods in these United States, (per semi-annual FBI Violent Crime statistics) shot distance and circumstance can NOT be accurately anticipated. How does air resistance have ANYTHING to do with the terminal ballistics as they relate to penetration?
damage One or two out of every twenty or more perfect placement leaves me desirous of a heavy hitter. The paramedics said he probably would not live. Richard, I guess I have little feminine hands as I prefer to carry my 9mm for self-defense and on duty. Most of the ballistic testing I have seen comparing the penetration of various bullets and calibers would suggest that generally, a .45ACP and 9mm are both quite comparable as far as penetration is concerned. The 45 is the preferred for close combat, Common sense will tell you that if you are being overrun! In the end public opinion and perception has a great deal to do with defense decisions. Weve known this for, what, eighty years now? I have both, like them all, and carry them because rifles are hard to conceal! In this article, we will present what we believe to be the most credible information regarding wound ballistics from studies conducted by the FBIs Firearms Training Academy in legendary Quantico, Virginia. F=MA always applies to the known laws of physics. It scares the hell out of me to think I might have had to use a 9 mm. cause if they did there would not be so many innocent victims being injured and killed all because they couldnt hit the side of a barn with a soft ball from 5 ft. Only high-velocity rounds (those with an impact velocity of 2,000 feet per second or more) with soft or hollow points reliably offer fragmentation. I imagine humans are the same. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); 2023 Concealed Carry Inc. All Rights Reserved. Its all about follow up shots. A century? I do believe that whether its a 9 mm or 45 caliber youve got to be accurate with the placement of that round otherwise youre just wasting shots. Im 73 yoa. Sudden, immediate and even instant death. It doesnt get more damaging that that. Remember, people dont have health bars. One single shot from nea When the .223 exits the barrel of a gun, it flies at more than 3,200 feet per second, and is still going 1,660 feet per second after traveling 500 yards. The science says otherwise. I have read how the 124gr 9mm ammo used by NATO does not do its intended job. Copyright 2023 I spent FAR more money letting her out every pistol they had for rent than I did purchasing her final choice. I also reload/handload have shot competitively and have hunted all my life. I like both, so it is a matter of how balanced and comfortable is it when in use ? I also am a NRA Certified Instructor and gunsmith in Colorado. I have several.
The Simple Physics That Makes Some Bullets Deadlier Than Very accurate and deadly, The bullet travels at 1450 FPS. Leave it to a bunch of idiot Marines to bring a pistol to a rifle fight. However, for the civilian this is generally an impractical plan for a variety of reasons. Pain is generally physiologically irrelevant, but where present often just makes motivated targets angry and thus, more motivated. Plenty of gang shootings. Much more likely is that you will be suddenly and unexpectedly attacked by a rapidly and unpredictably moving target with limited opportunities for counter attack. Whether it hits the shoulder, the leg, arm, hip, whatever. He was a deputy sheriff. Tissue inside the human body is remarkably elastic, even vital organs such as the lungs, bowels or circulatory system. WebA 9mm -40 - 357sig -45 ACP all do about 11-13" penetration into the human body no temporary wound cavity, and the diamiter differnce is from 9mm(.355(.357 caliber)) to 11.5mm(.45 caliber). Kimber 1911 Rapide Dawn .45 ACP Pistol $ 1649 99 1649 dollars 99 cents. The will to live and fight varies from person-to-person. In the technical language of ballistics engineers, the standard unit of measurement for a bullets mass is grains of metal, and depending on the manufacturer, a .7.62. can weigh in at 125 grains.
45 ACP The money has to come from somewhere. Its too small. Its certain to elicit a wide variety of opinions and almost as likely to stir up an argument. 15 round mag of 9mm FMJ unless you hit the heart better plan on using 3 to 5 rounds to stop the person. Yes, yeas I have. I sort of like the Canik TP9v2, with Browning BXP xpoint 147 gr load. The tests resulted in the selection in 1989 of the 10mm bullet as the most effective and accurate round for FBI agents to carry. by Kyle Mizokami Key Point: These are the bullets that will do the The body's liver, pancreas and kidneys also can make about 1 gram of creatine per day. If you dont have an excellent chance against a large carnivore with it. In winter I concealed carry a 1911. This is just one of them: https://www.policeone.com/police-heroes/articles/6199620-Why-one-cop-carries-145-rounds-of-ammo-on-the-job/. The past 45 years never needed more than one shot. When the cavalry at the time switched to the .45 round, the round was effective in doing enough damage to put them down more effectively. A 9mm round fired at close range to the skull with the correct ammunition will be fatal nearly all the time. Guy KEPT COMING and managed to shoot back twice. Not aim shoot. Also another fact is that my Kimber Colt 45 actually has less recoil than my 9mm with an aluminum frame when my 9mm has a full steel from. Seems to me that American businesses take it in the chin enough already without this insult.
The 5 Most Controversial Handgun Rounds The one thing Ive learned and seen over a lot of shooting is that a 9mm with FMJ bullets is mostly useless. The fact is, 9mm is fast and cheap, .45acp is big and just as effective if not more, given the wound channel is gonna be much larger than that of a 9mm. In this dangerous time period, an officers adversary can continue his deadly actions against an officer. 3 more replies -8w7- 13 hr. Circulatory collapse results from massive bleeding caused by bullet wounds primarily to the heart, other major organs or major blood vessels of the torso. He carries a nine personally currently because of the round capacity but in combat 45. Im sure, given the choice, MARSOC troops would take a 15 round FNX45 over a Glock 15. So modern ammo IS NOT the reason to switch back to the 9mm. During each tour I was personally involved multiple combat engagements. Copyright 2023 At that long distance, the .223 will slam into its target with almost twice the speed of the .22. In my book Lethal Force and the Objectively Reasonable Officer, I point out that after the FBI shootout in Miami, the FBI Firearms Training Unit, under the leadership of Unit Chief John Hall, tested 9mm, 10mm and .45 caliber rounds. But associates I worked with and against on jobs they all use one main gun to kill with the 9 mm with silencer.
Smith & Wesson Model 26 | Project: Aftermath Wiki | Fandom The germans used 9mm forever and they know their guns and war making. But honestly, if you cannnot conceal a 1911 you cant conceal a G19.. Thats a bs statement, I know this because I carry concealed and my 1911 conceals just as well as a single stack 9mm compact. and departments. If you can fire without remorse. first handgun i ever fired was glock27 .40SW she was snappy at first but 16 years later and after shooting lots of .45 and 9, i am back to .40SW for HD purposes. I think everyone should think back to why the 1911 was made. The better the bullet and the shot placement of an officer, the more likely the officer will go home after a shooting. But the modern bullets are getting better all the time! 2 from 15 ft, 2 from 25 ft, jumping to 2 from 50 ft. And 2 from 100ft. 10..again 10 rounds landed on target. Platt was killed at the end of the gunfight, but not before unleashing deadly mayhem. Gramins was using a 13+1 capacity Glock 21 in .45 ACP. A tenured officer responded to a violent male mental on a *TD bus. R45 Ammo Type: .45 ACP. Media in category "Human body" The following 64 files are in this category, out of 64 total. I have several 1911 pistols. I have shot many different calibers. Everyone talking about knock down power verses speed seems like. You're Dead: 5 Deadliest Bullets In The World They're just as important as the gun that fires them. In the last 30 years, the FBI has moved from .38/.357 caliber revolvers to 9mm semi-automatics. That use the same ammo is the way for me. In combat the one thing that does count is having more capacity, whether you miss or have more threats to neutralize, more capacity is a good thing no matter how you look at it. Repeat over and over, and keep doing so even after proficiency is achieved. To the extent the wound components cause or increase the effects of these two mechanisms, the likelihood of incapacitation increases. Most people ask to be shot with the 9mm instead of the .45acp. This remained the norm in the FBI until May 2014. The projectile, a 7.62 x 39 bullet, hit the House majority whip with between 370 and 1,550 foot-pounds of force. Anyway great comments to all. Thats the secret. I Have hair and an angular face. %20
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